The United Kingdom: The RISHI RICH Sunak ERA

Ag said:
As a history teacher it's pretty easy to throw into the mix. How you add it into science, P.E. or maths, I have no idea.
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I once had to do a maths lesson for Year 2 that incorporated the school value of ‘community’ and the British value of ‘tolerance’

THANKFULLY i’m now in charge of teaching and learning at my school so there’ll be none of that hoop jumping nonsense :disco:
 
Wait, how can you teach maths if you don’t have a degree in it? In Scotland, you have to have a degree or at least 50% of your degree in a subject in order to teach it.

Also, I think maths is already compulsory in Scotland until you leave school. Although we have a different system where you take 5 subjects each year instead of the 3 A Level students take.
 
big rowan said:
I dropped out of A level maths because I had a double lesson on Monday morning and pills were more interesting, but I found it really dull after thriving on maths at GCSE. My tutor used to say A-level was tougher than a degree.
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Same for me (except the pills).

I chose to do maths at A level but gave up on it after two lessons, when I realised reading a few novels and plays and waffling on about them for a couple of years would be far less work.
 
Kalabaliken said:
Also, I think maths is already compulsory in Scotland until you leave school.
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I didn't know that! Is that relatively new or has it been around since the Curriculum for Excellence was introduced?

I hated maths and dropped it after Standard Grade level. However subject options at my school meant I had to study Higher and Advanced Higher RELIGIOUS STUDIES in 5th and 6th year as the alternative.
 
ah @ZenGiraffe, I think you might be right. I got my higher in 5th year but my school didn’t do CSYS (the old name for Advanced Higher) so I had a free period.
 
Maths (and French) was my favourite subject at school. I loved it and I was good at it. I do think that it’s acceptable for kids not to be good at maths unlike with English.

I see it in public too - if you are unable to use grammar properly you’re often pulled up about it but if you can’t calculate 12 times 24 then people just laugh. Maths gets a really bad reputation but you’d be surprised how useful a lot of it is. But as a nation we think it’s acceptable to be bad at maths. I’m not talking about being able to do integration easily, I’m talking about basic arithmetic.
 
I was very good at it to a point and it was only when I got through fast Maths and did Additional Maths at GCSE that I realised that I found the rest of it boring boring boring and that there were others who actually were suited to it. Enjoyment of your subject is a massive thing and isn't stressed enough.

If I had have been talked into Science at GCSE and Maths at A Level like they were trying then I know my grades would have been considerably less strong and I would have been MISERABLE for two years.

I'm glad I chose Drama instead, and really I think a creative outlet in school at that age is what they should be pushing, assessed or otherwise.
 
I was in top set for everything at school except maths. Just couldn’t get my head around, and I’ve been vindicated ever since!
 
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This was the top story on bbc radio news this morning and it’s all over twitter do I guess MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.
 
Well I mean it’s acceptable to be bad at things of course, but what I don’t like is how it’s almost a badge of honour to be bad at maths
 
Diddy said:
Well I mean it’s acceptable to be bad at things of course, but what I don’t like is how it’s almost a badge of honour to be bad at maths
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has anyone really said that? I don't think anyone is suggesting that.

however maths as taught as school just doesn't have many relevant real-world uses. most of my girlfriends here work in paid media, managing accounts and ad spending for various clients, and yet I'm 5x faster than all of them at figuring out what 14 x 12.5 is if you challenged us to it. even in jobs in which you need to be able to handle fairly basic sums, you can just pick up a calculator. if you're not working in economics, you really don't need to have studied maths to 18. it's nonsense.
 
I do believe that prioritising financial literacy over stuff like algrebra and long division would make a lot of sense, especially at the early stages.

But I really resent the Tory idea that Maths and Sciences is somehow purer or more important than literacy, art, music and other subjects that actually encourage the development of empathy and critical thinking.
 
Jark said:
has anyone really said that? I don't think anyone is suggesting that.

however maths as taught as school just doesn't have many relevant real-world uses. most of my girlfriends here work in paid media, managing accounts and ad spending for various clients, and yet I'm 5x faster than all of them at figuring out what 14 x 12.5 is if you challenged us to it. even in jobs in which you need to be able to handle fairly basic sums, you can just pick up a calculator. if you're not working in economics, you really don't need to have studied maths to 18. it's nonsense.
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No nobody has said that in this thread or generally on moopy, I don’t mean that

But you know what I mean don’t you? It’s not even just maths but there’s a reluctance for many people to just accept they aren’t good at certain things, instead they make out it’s better to not know things. I always hated that, I guess the Essex reality TV stars highlight that well quite a lot
 
Nobody is endorsing wilful ignorance, but I think a better understanding that different people have different skill sets which are to some degree hard wired would benefit us all massively. So many people are alienated from further education by a system that pushes them into boxes they just don't fit into.

Forcing millions of kids to continue studying maths if they have no interest and limited aptitude seems like a classic example of that narrow view of intelligence, to me.
 
VoR said:
I do believe that prioritising financial literacy over stuff like algrebra and long division would make a lot of sense, especially at the early stages.

But I really resent the Tory idea that Maths and Sciences is somehow purer or more important than literacy, art, music and other subjects that actually encourage the development of empathy and critical thinking.
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Maths and Sciences also encourage the development of other skills, such as problem solving, lateral and analytical thinking, time management, communication. It's not just the subject matter itself.

Also maths is a linear subject. You have to learn the basics in order to know the stuff further on. Long division is primary school level anyway. I agree there is a need for teaching financial literacy but you need to be able to know how to multiply and divide things manually in order to know how to work out your annual gas bill split over the year.

The reason why they ARE trying to prioritise these subjects is because they have been neglected and there is a massive shortage of people with the skills and qualifications in these subjects.

They have a surplus of teachers in English, History, Biology but they don't have enough in Maths, Chemistry, Physics, Modern Languages, which has resulted in students being taught by people who barely have more knowledge than they do - it's fucking ridiculous that someone with just a GCSE in maths is able to teach the subject at school in England to a certain level. It's not just in education though, there is a serve lack of people of working age who have science and maths qualifications.

The replies from people in this thread prove that people do not think maths is an important subject - 'Oh I can just use a calculator' - that only gets you so far. You would not believe the amount of people out there who cannot even add two numbers together in their heads. And they laugh and go 'Oh I'm so crap at maths, lol'. It is NOT something to be proud of. It's an embarassment.
 
Kalabaliken said:
Maths and Sciences also encourage the development of other skills, such as problem solving, lateral and analytical thinking, time management, communication. It's not just the subject matter itself.

Also maths is a linear subject. You have to learn the basics in order to know the stuff further on. Long division is primary school level anyway. I agree there is a need for teaching financial literacy but you need to be able to know how to multiply and divide things manually in order to know how to work out your annual gas bill split over the year.

The reason why they ARE trying to prioritise these subjects is because they have been neglected and there is a massive shortage of people with the skills and qualifications in these subjects.

They have a surplus of teachers in English, History, Biology but they don't have enough in Maths, Chemistry, Physics, Modern Languages, which has resulted in students being taught by people who barely have more knowledge than they do - it's fucking ridiculous that someone with just a GCSE in maths is able to teach the subject at school in England to a certain level. It's not just in education though, there is a serve lack of people of working age who have science and maths qualifications.

The replies from people in this thread prove that people do not think maths is an important subject - 'Oh I can just use a calculator' - that only gets you so far. You would not believe the amount of people out there who cannot even add two numbers together in their heads. And they laugh and go 'Oh I'm so crap at maths, lol'. It is NOT something to be proud of. It's an embarassment.
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Don't you think that part of it is that a person with a third level maths or science qualification can get a much better paid job with a million times less stress than teaching their subject?

They offer a big bursary at PGCE level yes, but that doesn't do anything to mitigate the actual working conditions.

If teachers are continuously undervalued and job conditions continue to be terrible then there will be less teachers in STEM subjects especially.

That's not getting into the curricular issues, which granted they have made attempts to improve at primary level. I'm not sure about KS4+.
 
Barnacle 🌟 said:
Don't you think that part of it is that a person with a third level maths or science qualification can get a much better paid job with a million times less stress than teaching their subject?
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They can WHAT?!
Fuck :(

Tbh the career advice I got at uni (studying maths) was total shit. You can be an accountant or a maths teacher. No wonder I tried to cling on to academia for another year.

I mean sure I haven’t had to integrate a polynomial recently but the logical processes I picked up (as well as numeracy skills earlier) meant I could write sales reports, manage spreadsheets and all sorts.

I feel the anti-maths narrative seems to either suggest that it’s all just adding up numbers and calculators have replaced it, or that it’s totally useless in the real world because it’s complex number theory, both of which are wilful misunderstandings to make them feel justified in writing it off.

But before another person suggests this means I’m supporting Rishi’s stance despite saying I don’t, I think in almost every subject the knowledge is unlikely to be directly applicable/useful to the majority of students, but the skills picked up in the studying are the transferable useful bits, whether that be numerical analytical logical skills, creative critical skills, or even just a vague idea that some stats in a report are nonsense or biased, they’re all good things
 
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I have a first class Maths degree and I'm absolute shite at mental arithmetic 🥴 totally agree that it's far more about logical thinking and problem solving. I don't think people should be forced to study it to an advanced level, but I do think it's insane that basic finance and budgeting isn't taught in schools.
 
One of my dearest friends works for an evil international banking giant in the FINANCIAL CRIME team. He told me recently that he did a careers talk at a school, and the kids were SUPER INTERESTED in what he does and asking lots of questions. It was only afterwards that he realised he'd probably set them on a path to DO financial crime.
 
This fucking government just needs to die. Every day it seems that they’re gnawing away at our rights. They don’t even pretend to be working in our interests, it’s just open contempt.
 
Sometimes I think that Sunak is too stupid to be evil. I know that’s naive, but he just strikes me as one of those “Daddy never let me out the house until I was 18 and only then it was to play polo with my chums” sort of guy. He makes decisions based on his micro view of the world.
 
Suomi said:
THANKFULLY i’m now in charge of teaching and learning at my school so there’ll be none of that hoop jumping nonsense :disco:
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What age will you start them on eurovision studies? I'm thinking 5 for that, but maybe waiting till 6 for Melodifestivalen so they're old enough to enjoy and understand its importance.
 
funky said:
Sometimes I think that Sunak is too stupid to be evil. I know that’s naive, but he just strikes me as one of those “Daddy never let me out the house until I was 18 and only then it was to play polo with my chums” sort of guy. He makes decisions based on his micro view of the world.
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But he definitely thinks he's VERY VERY CLEVER.
 
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